MG Sports Cars

First:

I'm new to the BritishV8 group, but my wife and I have recently been looking for a good MGB GT for her.
She had a 1980 MGB LE a few years ago that she enjoyed driving and taking to car shows, but this time she doesn't want a convertible. She wants an enclosed car with all the glass for visibility the could have air conditioning added.
A coupe this time, something in the MK3 type GT with chrome bumpers, that would have adequate power and reliability for air conditioning and interstate travel.
Most of all I'd like to start with a rust free body. I'd rather do mechanical work.
If anyone has any leads on GTs I'd appreciate information and contacts.

Second:

I like the idea of the aluminum Buick/Rover V8, but has anyone had experience using the new 4 cylinder all aluminum ECOTEC drive train (engine and transmission)?
They are being removed from the late model Pontiac Solstice and Saturn Sky. There are companies converting these cars to the new General Motors LS series of crate motors so almost new drive trains are available.

Since the ECOTEC has a lot of GM Performance parts support, aftermarket programing, drive by wire throtle kit available from GM Performance parts, hadraulic clutch, etc.
I recently considered an ECOTEC for my Bugeye Sprite, but endeded up buying a later model 1275cc A-H Sprite for all the parts to upgrade to disc brakes and the larger engine.

The size, weight, power, reliability of the ECOTEC drive train might make it a decent alternative to a V8 in an MGB.
I don't mean to offend anyone, just looking for something real reliable for my wife so I can spend more time on my other car projects (most of which have V8s).

Now that my wife has seriously started perusing an MGB GT I'm looking for as much help and information as I can find. The happier she is with her cars the more I get to play with mine.

She is a member of our local British Car Club and I am listed as her riding mechanic.

Thanks,


(moderator's note: I shortened the thread title so it'd fit better in the message list...)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/05/2008 05:23PM by Moderator.

Hi Wray,

On your info and in your post, you dont mention where you are located. This might help if someone knows of something close to you. Also, the idea of the I4 is being discussed elsewhere as potential.

This site is for I4, V6, V8 and even V14 Diesels- if there is such a thing. :-)

-BMC.

Brian,

We are located in Huntsville, Alabama.
This past weekend we drove about 1,300 miles (round trip) to look at a "rust free" GT that we planned to buy.
A through examination of the car indicated that the coupe was far from rust free.

We have traveled as far as California and New Mexico to first visually examine cars before buying, but these were cars we were planning to pay a lot more for that what we are initially planing to spend for an MGB GT.

This being said if we were to find the right GT and my wife connects with what would be her toy we would be interested in a totally re-done GT with modern mechanicals.

We both enjoy the car hobby a lot, traveling and meeting new people.
Sometimes we have to sell some of our cars to enjoy another one for a while, but some of them become keepers.
Fay has decided that she would rather have a real nice MGB GT than her near perfect late model very low mileage M-B SLK320.
We have found that if we have too much tied up in some of the later model cars we have owned we just don't enjoy them as much.

Thanks,
Wray

There's a GT on e-bay -- no idea of the condition... [cgi.ebay.com]

Rob,

I have noticed that car on eBay and plan to call the number listed.
This is the second time this car has been on eBay recently and it did not net it's reserve.

A few years ago (about 2003) we drove out to this same area in Texas to look at a Puma.
Met a real nice guy with a collection of eclectic cars. A couple were French models I had never seen before, but i think the Lane Motor Museum in Nashville acquired at least one similar model and is restoring one for their collection.

It's really hard to tell what shape the body or anything else is in without visually inspecting the car in person.

Thanks for the heads up on the 74.

I have found some other Mk3 MGB GTs, but I believe they were the models prior to the ones where the engine bay was modified for commonality with the factory produced V8 models.

I believe the 1974 model year cars (probably started in production about August 1973) are the ones with the changed engine bay for the V8.

How much of an issue is it to use an earlier model for an engine swap?

Thanks,
Wray

I think you are looking for the '74-1/2.

Jim

Quote:

How much of an issue is it to use an earlier model for an engine swap?

I think you need to focus on a specific engine, or else questions like these are too hard to discuss intelligently. Even then, there are lots of variables, and lots of ways to skin a cat. You've asked about the later engine bay... the factory changed the inner-fenders to provide clearance for block-hugging exhaust manifolds. So what? For a V8 conversion (Buick, Rover, Ford... whichever) I would definitely plan on using "RV8 style" (through the inner fender) headers instead of block-huggers, so from my perspective there's no advantage to the later inner-fenders at all. (For a V6 or inline-four conversion, the inner-fenders shouldn't matter either.) Can you weld? If so, moving the radiator forward isn't a big deal. Dressing the corners of the pedal boxes is a little trickier, but whether or how much they need to be dressed depends on many factors. Rubber bumper ('74.5) GT's are pretty hard to find... and converting them to chrome (if you prefer that look) is relatively complicated/expensive, IMHO.

The mods needed for a Chrome Bumper car depends (sorry to be vague). Depends on your engine choice, motor mount location, how far back your engine is set, transmission choice, etc. Can be very minimal or no firewall mods at all to major surgery. For a very modern powerplant in the v8 realm I would think there's lots of surgery needed (toyota 4 cam v8 or ford), less surgery for a bopr or ford 302 or chevy v6 - not to mention these mods are well documented. I'm working on a 302 conversion with a 72 GT. The plan is for minimal firewall mods. Rob Ficorola and Dan Masters have well documented conversions that will give you an idea of the mods for top level cars as well as many others in the how it was done articles here. The ecotec conversion may take less in the way of firewall mods, but without drivetrain dimensions it's hard to say.

I'd received the same "conventional wisdom" that I needed to start with a rubber bumper car. I passed up a few very nice CB cars when I bought the one I'm converting. Now that I've fit the motor (including headers through the inner fenders vs. block huggers to help get heat out) & done the chrome bumper conversion, I would definitely agree with Curtis. It would have been way -- and I mean WAY less work to start with a chrome bumper car and I'd have saved the time & expense of tracking down the bumpers, brackets, filler pieces for below the tail lights, & little chrome plates that go below those. Now, if someone wants a pair of big & heavy but nice looking rubber bumpers, they're collecting dust in my shop!

One of the more problematic issues with most conversions is the steering shaft - it wants to occupy the same space as the left engine mount.
Rubber bumper cars have a modified firewall pocket that tucks the shaft u-joint out of the way of exhaust headers - it is definitely an improvement over the CB cars.

Good points Graham... especially if doing a V8 swap. I think addressing them is still less work & expense than the RB to CB conversion.

Note, I've found acquiring parts that no one ever wants to be pretty easy -- stuff like the steering cone or inner fenders, etc... All you have to do is go to e-bay & search on MGB stuff. Scan the listings for folks obviouslly parting out a car -- there's typically a few at any given time. Use the 'ask question' feature to send a note asking if they're parting out a car & if so, want to make a few extra bucks... let 'em know what you're after. I was able to get the cowl portion needed to swap to a metal dash for about $35 & a pair of inner fenders for about $40 -- both including shipping. That's also how I got several sets of Omni flares.

A good point, and anyone with a lathe and welder can modify the steering shaft length and make it look like it was never touched. Probably best to get the late column to go with the late firewall cone, plus the small u-joint and a steering shaft out of a junk steering rack is most useful. I've found any firewall mods to be relatively easy., even on the Roadmaster.

Jim

Does it have to be an MG? There are scads of TR7 coupes out there pretty cheap. Also, a GT6 might be a good candidate.

Wray, I'm late getting in on this post, but if you're still looking for a car you might contact Tony Barnhill [www.theautoist.com] He's over in Gurley, Alabama, not far from you and might have a lead on a nice GT for you. He's also a really nice guy to boot.
As far as engines go there are lots of choices, but for a neat swap for the wife the GM 3.4 V6 works well with either 5 speed or automatic. You can keep the computer control and have all the convience of a modern car in an older body.

Better be careful Bill, that might be considered sexist ;-) At 18 my wife had saved up and bought a brand new 1978 455 Trans AM. Personally I think that just boggles the mind. Almost as much as the fact that two or three years later she sold it because it was a ,"Kid's car".

Wray, I have the wife's roadster sitting in the shed waiting to be fixed up. As near as I can tell, she wants good economy and enough power to keep up. And an automatic. Other than that, she just doesn't care. Probably a 3800 Buick with an automatic would do just fine.

Jim

All,

Lots of good information from every one.

Last year at the SEMA show in Las Vegas I picked up a I picked up a Hypertherm Powermax 30 plasma cutter with the trade show discount and was able to spend some time evaluating the various MIG welders. I decided to wait a few months until a new Miller model can out. Now I have a new Millermatic 180 Auto-Set MIG system.
Its supposed to be easier for amateurs to use.
I am so busy at work I haven't had time to try it out. It's been MANY years since I've had a welding class, so I'll have to practice when I modify the home made trailer I picked up last fall.

Modifying and/or changing the steering shaft and universal joints shouldn't be a problem. There is so much available from the street rod market it should be easy. That is one of the next steps I face on the Deuce High Boy roadster after I fit the engine an transmission.

I should start with a good GT with a very sound body that runs and drives out okay for my wife to play with now.
Together we can decide what modifications will be best. If she falls in love with the car it will affect the drive train decision.
If she looses interest and tires of the car, then I might not make the same engine choices for me that I would for her.
Therefore it is best to hold off on the engine decision until we locate the right car for us to start with.
I am an old muscle car fan, and sports car lover, so a V8 would be my first choice.

I have stayed with carburetors for years, but am I rapidly becoming a believer in Fuel Injection.
I may install an Elderbrock FI unit on the ZZ4 350 in my ElCamino to improve the fuel economy and cold driveability.
With that said, I also recently got my 1965 Mini Traveler (station wagon) back from Mini Tec where they installed an Acura K20Z3 drive train. This is the second K-series i-VTEC using this news Honda engine that Mini Tec has built.
It is probably too much engine for the little Mini wagon, but it sure is fun. Scary Fast describes it best and you really have to be cautious driving the car. Just the right amount of throttle is fun, just a little too much will kill you instantly. In stock form in the 2006 Acura TRX Type S this engine was rated at 200 horse power.
Its now powering a very small car with probably less than 1,800 lbs. total weight. My guess is it probably is putting out about 220 horse power now, with piratically no tuning except the HONDATA computer, cold air induction and free flow exhaust. A simple Jackson supercharger would take this engine to over 300 reliable horsepower.
This is the reason I wouldn't want to do another over kill in a nice MGB GT conversion.

I talked to the owner of the GT in Texas that is on eBay now and the car has potential, but I don't think I can get out there to see the car before the auction ends. I'm don't like to buy a car until I have a chance to see it.
I am following some other leads, but nothing yet that I can't live without.

I e-mailed Tony Barnhill over in Gurley (the autoist), this past weekend, but he hasn't replied.
He is essentially just located on the other side of Huntsville from where we live.

The right GT will come along and I'm still searching.
Exactly what we do with it is yet to be determined.

Thanks for all the good advice.
Wray

Wray, I put a 2.8 Chevy V6 from an 87 Camaro in my Midget almost 10 years ago and used the stock computer and fuel injection on the car. I absolutely love it, just get in and turn the key to the on position, let the fuel pump bring up the pressure in the injectors for a couple of seconds and start it. No cold weather stumbles or anything, just nice smooth performance. It's just as reliable as and of our later models. Had a interesting comparison to original Spridgets with carbs last week, I forgot that they had to run with the choke for a few minutes until they warmed up. I had to learn to wait a bit when we were all going out together in the morning so that we were all warm and ready. If you can use an engine with a stock injection and ignition system I think both you and your wife will love it, especially with the load of an A/C unit. Injection makes the idle changes when the A/C in engaged and not a thing of the past.

Wray,

You really need to come join us in Wisconsin for our annual V8 (or V6, etc.) Meet. You'll be able to see & kick around lots of ideas with us.

Btw, I was born Brundidge (little town near Troy) & grew up in Huntsville.

Carol,

I wasn't aware there was a conversion convention until I read something about it on this forum recently.
It sounds like it would be very interesting, but I'm not sure I can work in a trip to WI this year.

A few weeks ago we stopped overnight in Kingsport, TN on the way home. I believe it was on a Friday night might have been Saturday night.
After checking in at a hotel we went out for dinner and found a large car show in a Wal-Mart paring lot.
We got there a little late, but we enjoyed seeing a different group of cars.
After you go to Crusie-Ins and shows in you own area for a while you start to see the same cars over and over again.

We had been on a road trip to Carlisle, PA for the Import and Kit/Replica Nationals then spent a few days in Virginia visiting family. I certainly didn't see any local cars at Carlisle.

Btw, I attended first grade in Kingsport, TN. My dad worked on a job there for about a year.
Small world.

Wray,

Sounds like you have some nice cars. I have driven and worked on a few Honda powered Minis and they are quite fun when built correctly. Currently, I am in the middle of a restoration of a 1962 Mini Traveler with an A+ and a BMW DOHC motorcycle cylinder head 16V and 5 speed w/FI and lots of other go fast things to boot.

If you like FI, then stick with it. I really like it because I don't have to go back and retune. Any time I have a problem, I can usually find it pretty quickly. You just have to know some basics about wiring and voltage (hardware) and if the software is messed up, just change out the ECU. Never had a bad PCM/ECU yet but have come across a few bad sensors.

-BMC.