MG Sports Cars

engine swaps and other performance upgrades, plus "factory" and Costello V8s

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BlownMGB-V8
Jim Blackwood
9406 Gunpowder Rd., Florence, KY 41042
(5564 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 12:59PM

Main British Car:
1971 MGB Blown,Injected,Intercooled Buick 340/AA80E/JagIRS

authors avatar
Re: Coil Over Bushing Failure
Posted by: BlownMGB-V8
Date: February 26, 2014 12:39AM

It's a lot to ask of any bushing.

Jim


mstemp
Mike Stemp
Calgary, Canada
(189 posts)

Registered:
11/25/2009 07:18AM

Main British Car:
1980 MGB Rover 4.6L

Re: Coil Over Bushing Failure
Posted by: mstemp
Date: February 26, 2014 10:03AM

Funny QA-1 have no issues according to Bill! Also it's how they are sold so one expects them to work. Gaz does employ Engineers so I expect them to work no mater what you believe should be used. If rubber works in lots of OE Coilover application I believe Polly can be formulated to function for more than 500 miles! Oh and Jim if you were the one who made the purchase and now had to rip it all apart you too might be a bit pissed.

Should anyone want to buy the Moss setup, order three sets of Energy 99105G bushings to use in place of what comes in their kit. Three are needed because one set needs to be cut up to get the extra length in the lower bushing, this is also what Gaz did. Or source one that has a wider spacing. Another option may be the nylatron bushing Moss sell for the lower control arms. Not sure of noise etc though. Other than the bushings I am happy with the kit. Moss has been stand up guys on this and they are working on a fix as well right now. From what they say Mike A and I were the first to have the issue.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/26/2014 10:54AM by mstemp.


302GT
Larry Shimp

(188 posts)

Registered:
11/17/2007 01:13PM

Main British Car:
1968 MGB GT Ford 302 crate engine

Re: Coil Over Bushing Failure
Posted by: 302GT
Date: February 27, 2014 11:23AM

I had GAZ shocks with my Hoyle suspension kit. The bushings failed in about 1500 miles; same for all replacements. I finally went to QA1 shocks and the bushings have held up well for over 10,000 miles. I also like the QA1 shocks better because the adjustment only stiffens the rebound; the compression damping is fixed and relatively soft. With the adjustable GAZ shocks, the compression and rebound are adjusted together. To get acceptable rebound damping, the compression damping was much too stiff causing the car to jump sideways on bumpy corners.


mstemp
Mike Stemp
Calgary, Canada
(189 posts)

Registered:
11/25/2009 07:18AM

Main British Car:
1980 MGB Rover 4.6L

Re: Coil Over Bushing Failure
Posted by: mstemp
Date: February 27, 2014 11:34AM

Larry,

With your replacement bushings on the Gaz, were they all Gaz or did you try another manufacturer?

Thanks,
Mike


302GT
Larry Shimp

(188 posts)

Registered:
11/17/2007 01:13PM

Main British Car:
1968 MGB GT Ford 302 crate engine

Re: Coil Over Bushing Failure
Posted by: 302GT
Date: February 27, 2014 09:56PM

I used GAZ replacements. I considered trying another type but then a shock shaft bushing wore out on one and I gave up on them.


tzorzo
Tony Zorzo

(1 posts)

Registered:
02/15/2009 04:56AM

Main British Car:


Re: Coil Over Bushing Failure
Posted by: tzorzo
Date: March 11, 2014 05:59AM

I have just installed Moss coil Overs and after reading above comments begining to wonder wether the cost and effort are worth it. if you guys are on average getting 500 highway miles from a set of bushes there is a major problem in manufacture and I would think both GAZ and Moss have a case to answer in selling sub standard components, that by the way are of a safty nature.
Has anyone taken GAZ and Moss to task on this issue.


mstemp
Mike Stemp
Calgary, Canada
(189 posts)

Registered:
11/25/2009 07:18AM

Main British Car:
1980 MGB Rover 4.6L

Re: Coil Over Bushing Failure
Posted by: mstemp
Date: March 11, 2014 03:29PM

Tony,

I believe Mike A and myself have both taken Moss to task. Simple answer is change out the bushing if you don't want to do it again at a later date. Maybe we were both just unlucky, maybe Poly is the wrong material. Just be sure to keep an eye on them over the first few 1000 miles.



trewjohn2001
John Trew

(4 posts)

Registered:
01/10/2014 05:30PM

Main British Car:


Re: Coil Over Bushing Failure
Posted by: trewjohn2001
Date: March 23, 2014 11:00AM

Any updates on this issue? Im just about to fit my Moss coilover kit.

Cheers

John


trewjohn2001
John Trew

(4 posts)

Registered:
01/10/2014 05:30PM

Main British Car:


Re: Coil Over Bushing Failure
Posted by: trewjohn2001
Date: April 14, 2014 02:53PM

Anyone using the same Moss kit in Europe can use PowerFlex PF99-111 - they are 95 shore. Don't know what the Moss ones supplied are but they feel softer than the powerflex bushes. Again you need 3 sets - one set you will need to cut up to make a spacer for the bottom shock eye.

Definately something amiss with the Moss Supplied Bushings. One shock was ok but when I took out the bushing from the other it completely disintegrated. It's more like crumbly wax than Polyurethane. Kit is maybe 8 months old and never been assembled.
image.jpg



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/26/2014 02:04PM by trewjohn2001.


Moderator
Curtis Jacobson
Portland Oregon
(4369 posts)

Registered:
10/12/2007 02:16AM

Main British Car:
71 MGBGT, Buick 215

authors avatar
Re: Coil Over Bushing Failure
Posted by: Moderator
Date: August 28, 2014 01:07PM

I tried to ignore this thread, hoping it wouldn't effect me. I installed the Moss/GAZ shocks shortly before driving to Palestine TX for BritishV8 2012. I drove to Omaha for the 2013 meet, and I've been driving a lot since then... so I guess I probably have at least 7 or 8 thousand miles on the bushings. I'm not getting any front suspension noise and I don't feel any slop in the front suspension with my car on jackstands. I can't see the upper ends at all without taking things apart. The bottom bushings look distorted, but I don't think they've collapsed or crumbled as bad as what's shown in photos above.

Now, I'm thinking of taking off on a long road trip. (There's going to be a great vintage car race at Watkins Glen.) So, I may try making/installing some nylon bushes in a hurry. Anyone have tips about making/using nylon bushes? If I need replacement bushings in a hurry, do you think I might find something suitable at NAPA or CarQuest? Rubber maybe? We didn't always have polyurethane options, did we? Or should I just get in my car and drive? They really don't look THAT bad.


BlownMGB-V8
Jim Blackwood
9406 Gunpowder Rd., Florence, KY 41042
(5564 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 12:59PM

Main British Car:
1971 MGB Blown,Injected,Intercooled Buick 340/AA80E/JagIRS

authors avatar
Re: Coil Over Bushing Failure
Posted by: BlownMGB-V8
Date: August 28, 2014 02:38PM

Curtis, might I suggest some alternatives to nylon, as it is known to absorb water?

The traditional choice in a more or less inert engineering plastic is Delrin. And that works fine but is quite hard, therefore does not give much isolation, and pretty much requires a lubricant to avoid squeaking. I would characterize it as a "dry" plastic. Probably more suited to competition uses.

I think UHMW (ultra high molecular weight polyethylene) would be about the best choice. It isn't quite as hard as nylon (but close), does not absorb water, has a "soapy" feel and is relatively self lubricating. Commonly used in equipment as bearing surfaces to lessen sliding friction. Generally a good bit harder and more durable than polyurethane, which is highly dependent on the particular additives used. Does not deteriorate with age. Available in standard forms, bar, sheet, rod, etc.

Jim


ex-tyke
Graham Creswick
Chatham, Ontario, Canada
(1015 posts)

Registered:
10/25/2007 11:17AM

Main British Car:
1976 MGB Ford 302

authors avatar
Re: Coil Over Bushing Failure
Posted by: ex-tyke
Date: August 28, 2014 05:19PM

Quote:
The bottom bushings look distorted, but I don't think they've collapsed

Mine too! ...this is the second driving season for the Moss/GAZ suspension. I've reconciled the fact that I'll be changing out the bushings this Winter probably with the Energy Suspension 99105G bushings.
Moss clearly has some homework to do to ensure a longer lasting product.


mstemp
Mike Stemp
Calgary, Canada
(189 posts)

Registered:
11/25/2009 07:18AM

Main British Car:
1980 MGB Rover 4.6L

Re: Coil Over Bushing Failure
Posted by: mstemp
Date: August 28, 2014 10:12PM

Curtis & Graham,

At least you got some miles out of them!
Nylatron, Delrin, Rubber, interested what you guys end up trying. Front inner control arm bushings are the same size for the top, bottom needs the extra set cut to make up the extra width.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/28/2014 10:32PM by mstemp.


classic conversions
bill guzman

(294 posts)

Registered:
01/09/2008 01:58AM

Main British Car:


Re: Coil Over Bushing Failure
Posted by: classic conversions
Date: September 02, 2014 11:10AM

Plain rubber bushings do not work on a vertical loading, A arms rubber bushings are loaded sideways and it is minimal.
High performance shocks use Delring bushings and Teflon (different compounds). To effectively use rubber bushings in a shock were the loads are vertical, will not work.

Standard shocks use rubber bushings, this bushings are pressure fit to the shock and it is a different compound. Once the rubber is pressed into the shock it is contracted which makes it harder.

If a rubber bushing is found that fits the shock in questions, then it can be pressed in to the shock with a sleeve to further compress the rubber.


BlownMGB-V8
Jim Blackwood
9406 Gunpowder Rd., Florence, KY 41042
(5564 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 12:59PM

Main British Car:
1971 MGB Blown,Injected,Intercooled Buick 340/AA80E/JagIRS

authors avatar
Re: Coil Over Bushing Failure
Posted by: BlownMGB-V8
Date: September 02, 2014 11:45AM

Stay away from teflon too since it creeps under load and deforms easily and permanently. Glass filled teflon is better but still deforms and is slightly abrasive. Delrin will wear unless lubricated, is the best for holding shape under pressure, but does not absorb side loads well because it is so hard. There is no ideal material for such high loading and the ultimate solution is to replace them regularly. Hence the "Race Only" designation. I'd try UHMW and if that doesn't work go to delrin and live with oiling and the squeaks(maybe). Or switch to heim joints which will still need replacing but at longer intervals.

Jim



Scott68B
Scott Costanzo
Columbus, Ohio
(521 posts)

Registered:
10/25/2007 11:30AM

Main British Car:
1968 MGB GM 5.3 LS4 V8

authors avatar
Re: Coil Over Bushing Failure
Posted by: Scott68B
Date: March 28, 2018 09:18PM

Ok, I'll bring this back from the dead in an attempt to get a "final" answer. Has anyone used the Energy Suspension 99105G bushing? If so, what is the verdict?


mgb260
Jim Nichols
Sequim,WA
(1894 posts)

Registered:
02/29/2008 08:29PM

Main British Car:
1973 MGB roadster 260 Ford V8

Re: Coil Over Bushing Failure
Posted by: mgb260
Date: March 28, 2018 09:35PM

Scott, Mike Stemp did in the first page in this thread. I don't know if Graham has yet.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/28/2018 09:38PM by mgb260.
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