MG Sports Cars

I currently have a 1960 MGA that is definately a project. I want to do a motor swap with a 2.0L ford zetec engine. Any recomendations on a transmission? Moss has a kit for a 5 speed conversion using a ford T9 tranny that says it doesnt require "much" trans tunnel modification, but since that was almost a euro exclusive tranny, any ones that will be easier to get a hold of to use without too much difficulty?

any other pointers you can give me? Ive helped do swaps on 240sx's before but nothing really this custom, so I am looking for any and all advice. Thanks

John

Welcome John ! The most commonly used transmission for swaps here in the states is the Borg Warner T5. Comes in a bunch of different configurations and gear ratios, but for a Zetec I'd think the ratios from the non World Class units would be probably better suited to the engine. Check the V6 Mustangs for this one. The Ranger also used a version, but I think you'll find the shifter position on that box too far forward for an MGA. The box isn't too large so tunnel mods will be minimal. Mostly it's deeper or taller than the MG box so you'll probably have to raise the top portion of the tunnel a bit. The width of the box is pretty good and there are some projections that can be trimmed off to clean up the profile. There is a very good article on the T5 and it's variations in the British V8 Newsletter, do a search and I'm sure you'll find it. You might also be interested in the How it was Done articles on MGA conversions and the information on my current project here in the Project Journals. The only car I remember featured using the Zetec is Richard Bondy's Sprite. He used a Ford type 9 transmission with a bellhousing from Caterham. [www.britishv8.org]

[quad4rods.com]

This company offers bellhousings and other parts for Zetec swaps. You can get a bellhousing for a t5 or a t9. Personally, I'd go with the t5 even if it needed a little more work to fit. So much more common if you have any problems with the trans.

correct me if I'm wrong, but unless I want there to be heat in the cabin, I dont need the smiths heater, do I? I dont plan on driving the car on any days but nice and warm ones so it wouldnt be nesscessary to have it if its only function is as a cabin heater

John, you are correct as far as the heat part, but it is a handy thing to have for defogging the windscreen on the inside especially when you drive on a rainy day, so keep it if you can is what I advise. I had to remove the one in my MGA project because of the length of the inline 6 but I'm looking at alternatives to mount over to the side. As far as only driving on nice warm days, I found the exception to that on my very first driving event I ever attended in my Midget. It was a nice spring day, but on the way home that evening it got a bit cooler and I was a bit uncomfortable until I could stop and turn on the heater tap. (Have to do it from under the hood on a Midget) After that experience I try to retain some type of heater in all my cars.
A big plus is to change the blower motor in the Smiths unit to a GM three speed motor and impeller. An easy change and really boosts the output of the blower. Information on that upgrade is at [www.mgexperience.net]

I don't know... I removed my MGB's heater twenty years ago and I've never missed it. I apply a fog inhibiting chemical to the inside of the glass every few years. The exhaust system sheds enough heat to keep the car warm through three seasons. If I wanted more warmth, I'd add electric seat heaters. My MGB is a lot lighter than original, but I guess no one would describe it as luxurious...

Incidentally, the mechanical geniuses over on the MG V8 Register website have determined that the specific way the Smith's heater was originally installed on factory MGB GT V8's actually causes the engine to run significantly hotter when the heat is "on". (Apparently, coolant bypasses the radiator...) However, I'm skeptical of their "technical notes". For one thing, they've been chasing cooling problems for 35 years and they still don't seem to have a handle on the topic.

What are some larger width wheels that will fit on my MGA. There are some available from Moss, but I was hoping for a cheaper option, maybe from another production car. Anyone have any ideas?

John, it really depends on what style you want and how wide you want to go. The original lug pattern is the same as that used by Triumph on the TR6, some models of SAABs, and the six cylinder Mustangs, Comets, and Falcons so there are wheels around that will fit and probably you could get fairly cheap. Probably the least expensive would be the Triumph wheels. The SAAB wheels are similar to Minilites and are getting pretty hard to find, but they're still out there. Hit the hot rod swap meets for the Ford 4 lug wheels in either original steel or aftermarket aluminum. These haven't been in production for a long time, so they're scarce as well. Unless you plan on modifying the fenders then about the nicest fit would probably be a 15"X5.5" wheel with a 195 series tire. That's the size I'm running on my Triumph TR6 wires and I think they fit the car well.

So, I am going to go in another direction with this car. I have a friend with an LS1 firebird, rear subframe is damaged and the car got totaled. He is offering to sell the whole car for $3k, and it is extremely tempting. Its a built LS1 but detuned to run 435 rwhp, built T-56 trans, z06 rear end, all the good stuff. Has anyone had any experience in putting LS1's into cars? I did a brief search on the site for MG's with the swap and I didn't see anyone who had done such a swap. The guy who is selling it is also a pretty skilled welder, so fabrication won't be that big of an issue, but yeah. Looking for any input, let me know!

Wow, now you really have me confused. You post about wider wheels that are cheaper than the Moss minilite style and the next thing is a change to a LS1 and a swap that will probably cost you 6 to 7 thousand more at the minimum in the end. We have several cars currently under construction with LS series engines. If you go that way you'd better be ready to deal with the electroncs, that's the only way they're going to run. What's this Z06 rear end? I'm not familiar with that one. The T56 will probably fit the MGA quite well, the shifter postition should fall very nicely in place for the driver, most are a bit far forward and require a bit of a stretch to get the lever to the front. With that much power you're entering another realm as far as the suspension goes. At minimum I'd consider MGB kingpins with a CCE Wilwood upgrade, more likely use their new hubs with the 5 lug pattern and the larger Wilwood brakes and match the rear better.

Bill,

A Z06 rear end. I believe he is reffering to a Z06 Corvette rear end, which can stand up to a LS1, LS6 or LS2 engine.

Then I am confused, I thought the Z06 Corvette had a transaxle not a standard differential assemlby and a T56. The combination as John listed doesn't make sense.

Well then I'm now confused too, and your're right about the transaxle.

This is from a Z06 setup.

Kind of funny, but this photo looks like a model...

I'm not sure you grasp the magnitude of what you are considering here. You start out talking about putting an inline 4 cylinder in place of another inline 4 cylinder and then jump to swapping in an LS1 V8 and Corvette running gear! The MGA is a narrow car, the Corvette is a W I D E car. You either have to narrow the suspension to fit under the car or widen the car to fit over the suspension. Either path you choose presents daunting challenges. I have done both with my MGB - I have put suspension from a slightly wider car (Jag) in a stock width B and I am currently significantly widening the car (11") to fit over Corvette suspension pieces. Taking a foot out of the width of a C4/5/6 Corvette drivetrain without destroying the geometry will require very high level engineering and fabrication skills. If you want to see what is involved with the "widening the car" approach look here [forum.britishv8.org] and you can see what I have gone through.

Make sure you know what you are in for before beginning surgery.

Jim



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/08/2009 02:16PM by Jim Stabe.

Got my 2.8 from a 85 S-10. It came with the T.B.I. I plan on switching that over to a carb.
The motor also came with a good automatic trans.
Is there anyway to make that combo work without too much trouble?
As I read more about this swap I`m finding that It may not be as easy as it first appeared.
What should I expect to have to fight with? Are there any other "tips" that might make this a bit smoother?
I know that everything I`m asking about is probably on the form somewhere but finding things as I need them is proving to be a real challenge.
I hope I`m not being troublesome, but I do want to have all the information I can get before I jump into this.
Thanks again for all the support.
Just a reminder, mine is a '72 Midget.
Mike

Mike, I don't know about using the auto trans. From what I've seen it's pretty wide and that would require a lot of fabrication to the main chassis rails to make room for the trans. A T5 barely fits and even then the tunnel has to be raised about 1.5" and lengthened about 3.5" to make room and that's with all the extra uneeded " ears" and such trimmed off the case. A v6 into a Spridget chassis isn't a "bolt in" at all, but doesn't require too much surgery or sheet metal work if you use the manual trans as several I've seen and my own Midget show. Here's a black and white photo of one side of the trans tunnel in my car during construction so that you can see how much metal was modified. P. S. I highly recommend that you start a new thread for your project instead of attaching to this one on the MGA as your information will most like get lost or overlooked here on this one. It's not difficult to do. You can also send me a PM if you have any questions relating to my particular swap. Good luck. Bill Young




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/17/2009 04:03PM by Bill Young.

John,

Re: MGA with an LS1.

You will need to widen the tunnel and engine bay at minimum. To fit the motor and gearbox in parts and piece and then you need to fit a rear axle, your going to need not a dime under $12,000 in bits and pieces. I bet you would spend over $15K and thats figured with you doing everything yourself AND that your MGA is a nice car and needs no major work. Since your going to have interior work when done, and body work, I am placing this in the catagory of $30K when you complete everything yourself.

Time frame? Depsnding on skill level, anywhere from 2 to 5 years. By this time, the LS series engine may be old hat with something better out there.

Food for thought.

-BMC.

Mike,

Welcome to the British V8!

Regarding the 2.8L V6, the engine is not at the power level of the LS1 and it was designed as ann option to 2.5L 4 cylinder GM cars so it takes almost the same space as the 'B' Series engines! Okay, almost, but you still need to move the goal posts on your MGA to fit.

The power output is higher but okay if you keep your stock differential in decent shape or better yet, trade it out for a 1968 to 1980 MGB differential which is almost a direct fit and can be found cheap.

The auto requires chassis reworking as well as tunnel. The T5 probably would require a little but the automatics are almost twice as wide requiring far more work.

You would have a better response to your posting if you start your own thread. We are all glad to help here but off topic postings are not always answered.

-BMC.