Triumph Sports Cars

hello everyone!

first, the introduction... i'm a custom car & bike builder based in nashville, tn. my specialties include sheetmetal fabrication & custom paint, but occasionally do complete builds from start to finish. i'm not new to squeezing large motors into seemingly small spaces as i've previously installed a ford 4.6 DOHC engine into my fathers 38 ford p/u. if that wasn't enough punishment, i decided to install the 4.6 SOHC in my 36 ford p/u project ( much smaller area to work in than the 38). my current personal projects are the 4.6 powered 36 p/u, a 69 mustang fastback & the newly acquired 65 triumph tr-4a.

a little about the "new project"... a couple years back, i made contact with an old high school buddy who i hadn't seen in almost 20 yrs. as luck would have it, after graduating in fl, i ended up in tn & he ended up in nc. we decided to have a reunion at his fathers residence who lives about half way between us. at the reunion, his father showed me his 65 tr that he has owned since 67 & wanted me to schedule it in for some restoration work. at the time i thought " wow, this would be a neat toy with a 5.0/t-5 combo out of a mustang vs. that little 4 banger". at the time i made a mental note to check into diffences in weights & see if the swap would be feasible with some chassis/suspension upgrades, then life took over again & i never really got serious about it. recently, while surfing the net searching for something i was working on at the time, i ran across a pic of a tr-4 & thought "i never did research that swap" & started looking into it more seriously. after a quick google search, i found this site & a few other sources with info & pics of swaps that have been completed & started the search for a car. after finding a few decent cars in the $3-4K range, i lucked up on this one in a craigslist ad for a shade over $1K. its a 1965 tr-4a (live axle), thats very solid & almost rust free (found a couple spots in the rockers under the fenders). the car arrived fri morning, along with an extra stock short block & extra w/s frame among other duplicate small parts. now the search begins for a good donor 5.0/t-5 (geez, i just went thru this on the 69 mustang...) then the fun begins... ideas i'm tossing around right now besides the engine/tranny swap are rollerizing the control arms instead of rebuilding with the stock rubber bushings & possibly a coilover setup instead of the stock shock/spring assembly. i'll also be looking into some brake upgrades as well as redesigning the hydraulic clutch actuation system. i designed & built my own crossmember, master & slave brackets on the t-5 in the 69 mustang, along with a neat bracket that mounts to the pedal to align the clutch master & get optimum pedal throw without any binding, so have a little experience in that area.

if there are any members in my area (nashville, tn) feel free to look me up & drop by the shop. there is always something cool going on! here are a couple pics of the car:

Looks like a good start Steve. Welcome.

Welcome,

You gotta love the TR 4 body style. Love the hood bubble!

Keep up posted on your updates!

I'm looking forward to this one. I wanted a TR4 instead of a TR6 but I never found one in my price range.


George

thanks for the welcome! i picked up the new motor today. was looking around on craigslist last night & found a complete engine & trans out of a 96 explorer with only 67k miles. it is the 5.0 GT40P motor & came complete with the trans, wiring, computer & all the accessories. bought the whole thing for $350, so figure i can sell the auto trans & some other things i wont need for the swap & just about have nothing invested in what i'll keep (i like FREE!). i've noticed in the photo gallery that everyone seems to run carbs instead of the EFI in the TR4's & TR6's with the SBF swaps. is there any height issues that cause the need for the change or just personal preference? i would like to keep the fuel injection if it will fit under the hood.

I used a carb like most people. I just wanted to stay old school. I think EFI is actually lower in height which is a good thing since height is an issue. On my TR6 I placed the oil pan of the 302 level with the frame rails. This caused a problem with the hood touching the carb so I ended up raising the body off the frame by 3/4".

[www.6-pack.org]


George



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/04/2010 12:28AM by motek.

Welcome. I'm using an Explorer motor and a T5Z in my Austin-Healey swap, but went with a carb because it was easier. [forum.britishv8.org] Sounds like you have the skills that going EFI won't be a problem. Besides this forum, I get a lot of ideas from the Factory Five roadster one: www.ffcars.com. Lots of guys there using Explorer motors and there's a good page listing some of the changes to make a truck motor into a car motor: [www.ffcars.com]. Top thing is obviously a cam change. I went with the Trick Flow Stage 1. This cam seems to work well with EFI as well as carbs. You'll probably have to go with a different MAF and larger injectors as well. You also have to be careful with headers with the GT40P heads, they can cause spark plug interference problems. Apologies if you know all this stuff already.

Rick

rick,

thanks for the links. i also have lots of good info at fordfuelinjection.com if i decide to keep the efi, i'll probably buy the harness from them, as they will build it & use some of the later connectors so i won't have to buy early sensors etc. there is also lots of changeover info like the factory five site, but with pics that help explain the proceedures.

decluttered the engine today after getting it on a stand. i still have a few bits to remove but looks better with all of the unnecessary stuff removed.



for anyone interested, here's a pic of the 4.6 i have installed in my 36 p/u. i think its actually a tighter squeeze than a v-8 in a triumph!

traded the 4R70W auto trans that came with the motor for a brand new, never used 4 lug fox mustang 8.8 rear with 3.55 traction lock. i think i'll narrow it to fit the tr4a & redrill the front hubs & rotors to the ford lug pattern to match. i'll have lots more wheel choices that way. also had a friend offer me an aluminum driveshaft free of charge (well, almost free, i'm making him a trans crossmember to fit an AOD in his 67 mustang). only "big ticket" item i need now is the T-5!

While you have the front hubs off, it would be a good time to do the Toyota rotor/caliper swap too. [www.vtr.org]

already on the "to do" list. neat thing about that upgrade is the parts seem to be cheaper than replacing with original type calipers/rotors.

thought i would pop in for an update. about a week after my last post, there was a fire & the shop burned to the ground along with all the contents. all totalled it was approx $150k loss . luckily, the triumph & 69 mustang werent inside, but i did lose a pair of 36 fords (not covered). hopefully, next week the construction of the new shop will begin & shortly after some equipment & tools to work with. the gt40p motor for the tr4a was inside, but in an area where there wasn't any direct flame, just heat, so am hoping internally it will be o.k. the sensors for the efi are toast, so will probably go carb if the motor turns out good. i am picking up another 5.0efi motor next week as a backup. its a good running, under 100k mi in a 90 lincoln for $200, so worth picking up. this week i've been thinking about wheels & trying to decide what i want. i've narrowed my options to:

1. widen the stock wheels to 7" & use the stock hubcaps for an original look.

2. 16x7" "minilite" replicas

3. the "pricey" option. redrill the lug pattern to 5 lug & using the 2005 mustang v-6 16x7" wheels. these wheels remind me of the vintage halibrand magnesium wheels seen on some of the trans am cobras in the 60's. i would sandblast the centers & clearcoat with a flat clear to dull them down a bit. i know this choice will depend on the offset of the wheels & whether they will fit correctly, but just a thought. here's a quick paintshop creation;



i'm just aiming to do something different from the norm. any opinions?? let me know what you think yea or nea...

I think they look nice.

Didn't early TR6s and TR250s use the same hubcap posts? That would give you a wider wheel if you want to go "originalish"

Dan B

Hi Steve,

I am a new member and going thru some old posts to try and get some info to accomplish a 5.0 efi swap in my 69 TR6. I am a novice compared to most of these guys including yourself but I think I have just enough skills to pull this off with a bit of help to get the efi all working. It sounds as if the efi is not going to be too tall if I read this post right.... this is good news as I really want to use the stock efi with a 5.0 and T5 as a complete setup and not touch the hood. Let me know if the fit is not as good as I think...please. Can you tell me if the later 4.6 like the explorer with gt 40 p heads you found is it the same basic size as the 90's 5.0 that have a similar looking efi setup? Being able to shop for later built engins woud give me a better chance of finding a lower mile setup.

I would live to see more on your car, this is an old post so some updates would be cool.

Dennis

Here is what I have found on the '97 Explorer 5.0 that I have:
The cast oil pan is 6" deep in the front, and 9" deep in the rear, with no front drain plug.
From the bottom of the front sump to the top of the original intake plenum is 25".
Overall height from the top of the front TR6 crossmember to the underside of the hood is 24".
I have constructed a custom plenum to replace the 6" high original plenum top to save 2". (Look in engine and transmission section)
I will replace the original cast oil pan with a stamped steel double sump pan, saving 1/2" at the front, and 2" in the rear. This
helps keep the rear sump from being so far below the chassis.
I will rebuild the front crossmember to allow recessing the oil pan sump 1" lower. (requires a 1 1/2" cut to allow 1/2" clearance to the pan)
I am doing it this way to prevent the engine from intruding as much into the passenger compartment.
So, I hope with my current engine height of 23", I will save 1/2" on the oil pan+1" on the crossmember=2" clearance to the hood. (the current measurement of engine 23" and 24" under the hood does not account for 1/2" clearance under the pan to the crossmember)
I intend to retain the fuel injection, with a stand-alone controller. (See 6-pack under upgrades for "Rusty", who has a MegaSquirt)
Dennis