Engine and Transmission Tech

Ken, Yes Rhodes lifters will definatey cure the problem of "subtle clicking of the valve train", LOL. Unless your running a pretty hot cam, the "tickies", will probably make, less power, of course the engine will "sound" wilder. Good Luck, roverman.

UPDATE: I finally got the Rhoads lifters installed. I had to pull the engine to replace the transmission input shaft bushing and shim out the hydraulic throwout bearing. I also re-shimmed the motor mounts so I could use the original steering shaft. NO MORE LIFTER CLACKING NOISE!!!!!!! So, that problem is solved.
However, after warming the car up, driving it a block and re-setting the idle in the driveway, a massive amount of oil began leaking from the left side of the engine. At first,I thought the rear main had failed, but, though I can't see the source, it appears that oil is coming down from somewhere on the driver's side of the block under the head. Any thoughts on the source or cause?

Valve cover gasket, dip stick, corners of the valley pan where the rubber seals butt up against the heads.

probabe source, as Todd says, the rubber seal under the lifter gasket/cover needs a dab of silicon on its ends, another possible source from that area is on some engines a small breather hole drilled into the back of bock around the lifter valley area, that can fall out and cause a big leak.

Todd and Ian, thanks for your responses.

When the leak occured, the PCVs, connection hoses and air filter were off the engine. I guess the crankcase
pressurized to the point of burping oil out the dipstick hole in the block. My dipstick did not have a seal at the top of the tube, so I fashioned one out of rubber hose, but I didn't successfully seal the dipstick tube to engine block dipstick aperture. After reading some posts on other sites and this site, it was pretty clear that was the cause of the oil leak.

Cheers!

To stop the dip stick poping out, weld or braize a small hook onto the tube about 2" from the top of the tube, and a similar one to the dipstick shroud, this allows you to hook a tension spring to the stick and tube stopping it popping out. shape the hooks so one end of the spring is used to retain the spring, and other made so its easy to pop the spring off when its time to check levels

"When the leak occured, the PCVs, connection hoses and air filter were off the engine."

Did you have the holes plugged?

I finally got the Rhoads lifters in, replaced the silicone rubber valve cover seals with cork(that's where the left side engine leak originated as the seal would bow inside the cover as the cover bolts were tightened), pulled the engine and transmission to shim the HTOB, install a proper pilot shaft OilLite bearing, re-shim the motor mounts, align the drive train, and paint the headers with ceramic paint. It's all back together and ran for about an hour before the Lucas DLM8 died. I found an old Buick 300 distributor on EBay for 24.00, installed it, adjusted the points gap, reset the timing and the car runs well. It has 60# oil pressure at cold start, 40# while running down the road and 20# at idle. However, I still have more valve train noise than expected. A mechanic friend thinks there may be too much valve lash. So, I may have some overworked rocker arms or shortened push rods on a couple of cylinders. I was thinking that if I have to go at this issue again, I may as well consider roller rockers and new pushrods. As usual, I can't seem to locate either. Any recommendations?







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/21/2010 12:30PM by kenzmyth.

Rhoades lifters are noisier than regular lifters. See if you have shims under your rocker stands. Maybe thinner shims or remove completely. When valve is closed you should barely be able to turn pushrod between your fingers. Should have about .020 preload. Maybe try Smith's adjustable pushrods. Are your rockers in good shape?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/22/2010 08:48AM by mgb260.

Ken, if your still running "Rhoads", they will always tick. I'd shoot for approx. .03" preload(cold), lessens as motor "grows". Lash caps are a "much" easier way to increase preload. Good Luck, roverman.

Valvetrain geometry on a shaft rocker design is a bear. I think it's usually a matter of getting the rocker-to-valve stem geometry set up using shims under the rocker stand, or lash caps, then installing the right length of pushrods.

I have 8 leftover Crane variable duration lifters left over from a Chevy project. I think the Crane design is quieter than the Rhodes design. I might use them on the exhaust lobes of a Crower 50229 cam in my Olds 215.

Thanks for the responses. The valve train noise I am referring to is a "clacking" sound; much louder than the lifter noise. We think it is excessive valve lash on ONE rocker/valve stem or a short pushrod.
On cold start there is no "clacking", just the nice Rhoads lifters clicking until the car warms up. It is not a continuous "clacking" as it goes away on deceleration and sometimes on acceleration. I have decided to take the car to a American Classics and Performance about 15 miles north in Petaluma. I hope to get the car up there this coming week.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/23/2010 05:32PM by kenzmyth.

Ken, If you can tolerate the oil splash, idling the engine with rocker covers removed, can be enlightening,I.E. bent push rod check, audible check and touch check. A skilled finger placed on top of each rocker, will tell the problem story. Push rods placed besides each other, between 2 straight edges, will help pin point short ones. Good Luck, roverman.

Very nice car, it is even in one of my favorite colors. Even the hood scoop looks nice and I don't usually favor those. Maybe you should just bring it to me. :D

I have a Rover engine going in that is a new build also and we are getting closer so I will be sure to keep your post handy if we run into issues. Of course I am praying for no issues. Really love the car though.

Art, Thanks for the post.

The latest is not much different than my previous noisy valve train issue. I took the intake and valley cover off, pulled the rocker assemblies. On inspecting the pushrods, it was clear that 8 of the sixteen were contacting the rims of the holes in the heads, two were quite polished in a band around the shafts. I bored out the holes in the heads by another 1/16". A preload measurement showed it to be around
.04"; right in the middle of spec: .02-.06". On visual inspection everything else looked excellent and new, as it is. After reassembly, installing a new Pertronix distributor and crossing my finger it started right up, sounded
good and responded delightfully to the throttle on my two block test drive. Then, the temp got to 190F and
the dreaded "clacking" returned, only louder this time!!!

I am taking the car to a mechanic I know who builds race engines here in town. Hopefully, he can get it sorted out. I am past the scope of my limited mechanical abilities and experience.

Michelle, Thanks for the compliments on my car. Yeah, I think it looks good, too. I put the GT350 hood scoop on as I needed something to cover the air cleaner and it would have been on a Mustang of the era. I cut it down in length by about 4" and pop riveted it on. Gives the car a "racy" look, though I doubt I will ever get on the track with it. Good luck with your Rover build.

If I ever do this again:

•Fuel injected Ford 302
•Fast Cars front suspension with 302 engine mounts
•No fender flares
•Super clean, no rust repair needed Late MGB and do
the chrome bumper conversion
•BW T5 WC transmission, again
•Chevy S10 rear end

However, I probably won't do another MGB V8 conversion. I am enjoying driving my newly acquired,
1953 MG TD which has an MGB 1800cc engine, 4 speed transmission and tube axle rear end. The paint
is tired, the tuck and roll upholstery all wrong, but it looks good from 10 feet, drives great and gets lot's of
attention wherever I go.

Ken, Did you reuse the old pushrods? Maybe one or more could have broken? That would make a heck of a clatter. I don't know why it would overheat unless the heads and/or intake manifold leaked. Did you retorque after warm up? Just trying to help you troubleshoot. I have had a few 215's,300 and 340 Buicks(similar).Also Buick V6's.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/02/2010 08:27AM by mgb260.

Is 190 F overheating ? What deg. thermostat ? Visual opening test, on the stove ? Oil pressure when that pesky clattering started again ? Jim, "It started right up and sounded good", not likely to have broken push rods. Ken, got an up-date? roverman.

Am I missing something? I don't know how anyone could call 190F "overheating". That's a perfectly normal operating temperature for many of us, and I'm completely comfortable with that gauge reading. (It's my personal belief that most people worry way too much about coolant temperature and would be better off if they didn't even have that gauge.) Modern oils are happy at that temp. Was there some other symptom? Steam or coolant escaping or blowing into the crankcase? Otherwise... I don't see any connection between coolant temp and clattering.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/02/2010 11:02PM by Moderator.

You guys are right, I didn't mean overheat,I meant the temp shouldn't be related to the clatter. Art, he said it got worse than ever after the 2 block test spin. I 'll have to reread my posts a little better. Been working about 12- 12 hour shifts in a row,must be a little tired.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/02/2010 11:07PM by mgb260.