Engine and Transmission Tech

My name is Dave Nelson and I am the engine builder of the Hot Rod 300 Stroker. I would like to set the record straight regarding my valve train conversion. Unfortunately, I did not have an opportunity to talk with Terry, and Joe’s recollection of the conversation is a little different. Joe was taking calls for me while I was away on a long over due vacation. It’s true that Joe is not familiar with Small Block Buicks and Rovers ( he has built Buick big blocks ), but he is a very highly regarded engine builder with over 40 years of experience. He worked for Edelbrock for 14 years in new product development and was credited by Hot Rod Magazine as being the first to put a Gen 1 Camaro into the 10’s ( in 1968 ) with a normally aspirated 350 SBC.
He is also credited as one of the first to put a 400 crank into a 350 Chevy in the very early 70’s, there-by creating one of the most popular stroker combos ever, the 383 SBC.
He won the inaugural Popular Hot Rodding Engine Masters Contest with a normally aspirated 365 c.u. SBC that made 614 H.P at a street friendly 6500 RPM on pump gas with a hydraulic roller cam and single 4 bbl. Carb. He competed and prevailed against some very well known and respected engine builders.
To be honest, it wasn’t clear to me what the demand would be for this conversion during the time I was building the motor and developing it. Because of this, I did a short production run and probably started later than I should have. But I sold the first sets right away (one person bought 2 sets) and got a little behind.
It doesn’t surprise me that there have been similar conversion for the Buick or Rover, but I was not aware of any and did not copy or knock-off anybody.
I also want to add, that although the conversion plates may look simple, they are a lot more complicated and there are more machining steps than what may appear. For one thing, the rocker studs are not perpendicular to the bar, they have to be set at the correct angle in order to achieve the proper rocker function and geometry while at the same time position the push rods correctly. .
My system utilizes a 5/8 thick, extruded bar of 6061 T6 aluminum for plenty of thread engagement. An extrusion is closer to a forging than a casting is and we have built race motors that rev well past 7000 RPM ( i.e. higher valve spring pressures )with stud mounted rockers in aluminum heads (356 castings ) and never had a rocker stud pull out or the stud boss crack.
Our motor made 10 pulls on the dyno several up to 6300 rpm with absolutely no problems. I check the lifter preload after this session and nothing changed. Currently, this motor resides in a beautiful 67 Skylark and has accumulated several thousand miles. Again, we recently checked the valve adjustment and, as before, no readjustment was needed.
We usually recommend up-grading to a high-end Jessel style shaft mounted roller rockers when building a race motor with a big solid roller cam a ultra high valve spring pressures. Stud mounted rocker have proven to be very reliable in stock and high performance engines for many years, in part, because they oil better than factory shaft systems.
Also, stud mounted rocker geometry is much easier to correct (simply accomplished with push rod length) than shaft rockers, especially if you change valve lengths.
What Joe said when asked about the reliability of our system was that we have not had any call backs from the customers that purchased our kit meaning: no complaints or problems. We just sold a kit with large trunion, stainless steel rockers for $560.00. You wouldn’t want to run a T&D or TA shaft system with the wimpy stock .250 dia. Buick solid push rods and Chevy lifters are a lot cheaper than Buick lifters.

Dave

Thanks, David. The 5/8" thick bar in the pictures look pretty stout. The picture I posted, it looks much thinner, I assumed 1/2". How much would you sell just the bars for? I read quite a few articles about Joe's engine work and never doubted his expertise.

Unfortunately I have a rover with a 500 plus lift cam I bought with roller rockers and they appear to have not markings on them so I dont know what they are? I am trying to get information on them and also what was done to the bar. I know that Group 44 and Ken Slagle ran roller rockers on thier engines and from both of them Group 44 suffered an issue with a roller rocker stud pulling out the threads in the head. The only real problem is valve covers. The standard SD1/TR8 dont fit and the rocker arms hit them I tried a set or early Rover 3500/P6 and they might work. I know you can use later ones and do some shaving or remove the baffle plates but them you will get oil in the breather/vent line really bad.

If your expecting pulled studs, I suggest "Timeserts" installed from the bottom, of plates. IMHO, roverman.

Dyno Dave, Glad to hear from you. To set the record straight as per my conversations with Joe his recollection of the conversation and mine differing matters not in the least mine is the true and correct version! My phone conversations are automatically recorded and stored. if you would like to hear the exact conversations we had i would be glad to provide them for you, i highly regard Mr Shermans skills and achievements as well as his contributions to the developments made that have carried over and become mainstream in chevy stroker conversions on and on. As for geometry the T.A. performance roller setup is achieving great sucsess and acolades in the Australian rover world where they are and have been taking the rover/leyland engine to amazing performance and longevity heights. I felt i needed to address this miscommunication between myself and Mr. Sherman as with your post it brings into question my integrity, as ive said my only issue was his lack of customer support and overly rude deameanor demanding money. He went on and on about not seeing any money and we will see how this kit pans out, also i was told he had only sold one. This forum deserves truth and open sharing of experiences of such. I have had good experiences with any communications on this forum. The parts we chose to build our engines and their resulting outcomes is something we all learn from so communicating our results is just good for all of us. I do wish i had the good fortune to have spoken to you rather than Mr. Sherman and maybe i would be running your setup on my engine. i went with T.A. because of their customer care/support and the Proven quality of their system. No hard feelings from me im not the onw who lost the sale. Best regards

Jim,
The basic kit, which includes the adaptor plates, studs and counter sunk mounting bolts is 289.00. As of today,I have 3 left in stock but based on recent conversations, I may be down to 1 by the end of this week. More on the way, my next production run is bigger.
If you would like to talk to me about this and other kit options, send me a personal message with your contact info.
Thanks for your interest
Dave

Mike,
We remember seeing non screw-in studs pull out in cast iron heads in the old days and valve float was widely believed to be the culprit. It is also possible that the studs were over torqued causing thread damage. This is not very common and is more likely to show up under extreme race conditions.
You never see this happen on street motors or even week end warriors.
We used stock Buick valve covers with one gasket and had no clearance issues. But it could be a problem with some covers depending on the baffles. It may be possible to eliminate the baffle under the cover to gain clearance and use a breather cap with a nipple for a PCV hose to the PCV valve.
Dave

Terry
First let me start be saying that I very much wish I had been able to speak with you. I have known Joe a long time and naturally I might be a little bias. It is hard for me to determine exactly what the circumstances were during the time you called (there have been a lot of calls) , but some kits were sold and not yet shipped because we were waiting for custom ground cams from Comp Cams to arrive. I know that there was an issue with ordering the wrong rocker arm ratio, but I believe it was a different person.
Anybody who is in business knows that there were times when they didn’t handle a situation or customer as well as they should have and Joe is no exception. I can understand how a person might become impatient and abrasive with customers at times if they have been dealing with the public for as long as Joe has. Regardless, it still should not happen and I apologize for any miss treatment. In all fairness to Joe, I have to take most of the blame for not having more product ready to ship and putting Joe in the middle of this situation.
Regarding TA’s shaft system, Correct me if I am wrong, but their shaft rocker system for the 215/300/340 retails for $900.00, not including push rods and lifters. Both systems, shaft or stud, would require aftermarket tubular push rods and likely new lifters. With my system you have a choice of rockers, even stock stamped steel (still more durable than original with better oiling ) if you are on a budget. The rockers used on the magazine motor have large trunions, are made of 8650 Chromemoly steel and are considerably stronger and stiffer than aluminum rockers. Even with these high-end rockers our kit price is less.
We offer kits with custom ground cams using the latest lobe profiles and will spec out an optimal grind for a customers combination. I know the TA shaft rockers are a quality piece, but they offer no performance advantage over stud mounted rockers, especially if you use high strength and ultra stiff Chromemoly steel rockers like Comp.’s Ultra Pro Magnum.
I would like to speak with you personally. If you are open to it, send me a personal message with your phone no. and a good time to call.
Thanks
Dave