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tips, technology, tools and techniques related to vehicle driveline components

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jfjfjf2
Julian Fussell
Somerset
(17 posts)

Registered:
02/18/2012 01:00PM

Main British Car:
TVR Griffith '94 RV8 5ltr

RV8 Custom crank
Posted by: jfjfjf2
Date: February 22, 2012 11:38AM

I,d like to get a light weight crank made but I need a technical drawing as the people I am asking to quote have never made one before. Does anyone have access to one for the large journal Rover V8?

Thanks,

Julian


roverman
Art Gertz
Winchester, CA.
(3188 posts)

Registered:
04/24/2009 11:02AM

Main British Car:
74' Jensen Healy, 79 Huff. GT 1, 74 MGB Lotus 907,2L

Re: RV8 Custom crank
Posted by: roverman
Date: February 22, 2012 04:36PM

Julian, I suspect "John Eales" and others who make/sell stroker cranks, have drawings. They "may" not be free with them, since you aren't buying crank from them ? Billet crank ? Cast/forged 4340 ? Might be easier to supply them with a sample oem crank. Application ? The Ford Windsor raw forging can be machined to fit, and should handle ALL the hp/rpm you can throw at it. Good Luck, roverman.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/22/2012 05:28PM by roverman.


jfjfjf2
Julian Fussell
Somerset
(17 posts)

Registered:
02/18/2012 01:00PM

Main British Car:
TVR Griffith '94 RV8 5ltr

Re: RV8 Custom crank
Posted by: jfjfjf2
Date: February 22, 2012 07:03PM

Art - I'm trying to source an 83 mm stroke lightweight billet crank and combine it with a 97 dia bore block. I thought I'd get quotes from Scat and Crower and see where that gets me. The car is a '94 TVR Griffith which weighs under 1100 kg.

You might be right about having to send oem cranks, I am trying to avoid the time and expense involved in sending two cranks (which I don't have lying around) to the US. I'm sure crank suppliers here in the UK would be very helpful if I was buying from them but those I have seen though man enough for the job are somewhat agricultural. I might know someone with a drawing but they are very hard to pin down, hence the post.

Thanks for your reply.

Julian


roverman
Art Gertz
Winchester, CA.
(3188 posts)

Registered:
04/24/2009 11:02AM

Main British Car:
74' Jensen Healy, 79 Huff. GT 1, 74 MGB Lotus 907,2L

Re: RV8 Custom crank(s) ?
Posted by: roverman
Date: February 22, 2012 09:08PM

I am within driving distance of both. Eagle made a crank for a "V8Buick" forum member, off the radar, turned into a BIG OL" MESS ! You aren't going to like the billet prices. Perhaps Scat could be tempted to machine raw ,sbf 4340 forgings into sbb/rover cranks, say (3) ? They have the raw forgings. With TA heads available, a "few" of the Buick folks would be on board. Jim B., do you agree? According to Triumph Rover Spares,"the Rover will produce 600 hp.", with ported TA heads,all motor. This makes the available cast cranks pretty marginal. Cheers, roverman.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/22/2012 09:20PM by roverman.


minorv8
Jukka Harkola

(268 posts)

Registered:
04/08/2009 06:50AM

Main British Car:
Morris Minor Rover V8

Re: RV8 Custom crank
Posted by: minorv8
Date: February 23, 2012 01:56AM

Julian, have you considered Farndon ?


jfjfjf2
Julian Fussell
Somerset
(17 posts)

Registered:
02/18/2012 01:00PM

Main British Car:
TVR Griffith '94 RV8 5ltr

Re: RV8 Custom crank
Posted by: jfjfjf2
Date: February 23, 2012 04:45AM

Jukka - Farndon could supply the correct spec but they don't make anything like the Scat superlight, I know I would get a good crank fit for purpose and I may well end up buying from them but I'd like to explore other possibilities.

Regarding prices Art, this is a very small country and everything is expensive, a Farndon crank would cost c.Ģ2500 or near enough $4000. It's rumoured that TRS are sourcing cranks for the TA heads in the Far East but I doubt they will be any cheaper to the end user than a custom crank from the US. If I had any sense I'd use an LS crate engine but that wouldn't warm the cockles of my heart.

Julian


rrrover 5L
John Caine
Australia
(28 posts)

Registered:
08/16/2010 08:44AM

Main British Car:


authors avatar
Re: RV8 Custom crank
Posted by: rrrover 5L
Date: February 23, 2012 07:37AM

I may know something here.....

I'm fairly certain that Ford v8 forging blanks are where most Rover/Buick customs emanate from.

Mickey Thompson used them in his Buick powered desert racing buggies.

I have a Bryant Ford billet sitting in a Rover block which needs some widening on the journals, a custom rear seal & flywheel and some nose work to complete. I suspect someone like Moldex who regularly produce Rover/Buick cranks would modify them with ease.

Byron's twin turbo project B has a custom Moldex billet crank in it.

John



BlownMGB-V8
Jim Blackwood
9406 Gunpowder Rd., Florence, KY 41042
(6468 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 12:59PM

Main British Car:
1971 MGB Blown,Injected,Intercooled Buick 340/AA80E/JagIRS

authors avatar
Re: RV8 Custom crank
Posted by: BlownMGB-V8
Date: February 23, 2012 08:26AM

I think one or two of the SBB drag racers are running Moldex cranks. Very likely what you are talking about. I also recently read a post where someone was lightening a crank by chucking it in a lathe and turning down the counterweights. You'd have to get it balanced of course but with light rods and pistons that shouldn't be much of a problem.

Jim


roverman
Art Gertz
Winchester, CA.
(3188 posts)

Registered:
04/24/2009 11:02AM

Main British Car:
74' Jensen Healy, 79 Huff. GT 1, 74 MGB Lotus 907,2L

Re: RV8 Custom crank and cockles
Posted by: roverman
Date: February 23, 2012 11:44AM

Julian, I can appreciate your not abandoning the Rover V8. 97mm bore? Is this a Wildcat symeese block ? If not, it's likely the sleeves will be wet ? I think the rover V8 is about to have a long moment in the sunshine. With the right material a crank benefits from pendulum cutting the counterweights and hollow boring the crankpins. This removes weight with best benefits. Turning down the counterweights diameter is best for final balancing. I'm not convinced oem Buick cranks will sustain 700-1,000 hp. with any reliability,(but that IS the rumor). Onward, roverman.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/23/2012 01:55PM by roverman.


jfjfjf2
Julian Fussell
Somerset
(17 posts)

Registered:
02/18/2012 01:00PM

Main British Car:
TVR Griffith '94 RV8 5ltr

Re: RV8 Custom crank
Posted by: jfjfjf2
Date: February 23, 2012 02:57PM

Jim - Thanks for the suggestion, I've emailed them. Art - Coscast block bored as for 96 mm but with thinner flanged liners gets you 97 mm. I forget what they are called, I'll post at a later date with the spec. Re the crank, I'm not seeking 700+ bhp but I would like to have 7500+ rpm on tap and a highly responsive engine. Even if the oem cranks could cope with torque/bhp/rpm demands I want to lower reciprocating mass. I will be using the TA heads and I'd be surprised if anyone else intending to wouldn't be up rating the bottom end. The first crank manufacturer to cater for our needs should pick up business from most US/UK TARV8 head buyers.

Julian


roverman
Art Gertz
Winchester, CA.
(3188 posts)

Registered:
04/24/2009 11:02AM

Main British Car:
74' Jensen Healy, 79 Huff. GT 1, 74 MGB Lotus 907,2L

Re: RV8 Custom crank, We need a blank-crank drawing.
Posted by: roverman
Date: February 23, 2012 04:08PM

Clan, I have emailed "Bryant Racing Cranks" and Scat. Higher production #'s should favor forged cranks, cost wise.Update, looks like I will be sending a "sample" crank to Scat. A light dampener and flywheel/clutch assembly, will also rev up/down faster. We shall see. roverman.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/23/2012 05:57PM by roverman.


jfjfjf2
Julian Fussell
Somerset
(17 posts)

Registered:
02/18/2012 01:00PM

Main British Car:
TVR Griffith '94 RV8 5ltr

Re: RV8 Custom crank
Posted by: jfjfjf2
Date: February 23, 2012 06:01PM

Art - Nice one.

JF


roverman
Art Gertz
Winchester, CA.
(3188 posts)

Registered:
04/24/2009 11:02AM

Main British Car:
74' Jensen Healy, 79 Huff. GT 1, 74 MGB Lotus 907,2L

Re: RV8 Custom crank, let's "forge" a consensus .
Posted by: roverman
Date: February 23, 2012 06:35PM

Let's start a want list. I think 2.5" main size and 2.1" rod journals are good for sbc rod selection, remember hollow crank pins ? Rover 1 pc. rear seal and standard rover bolt pattern. Early or late snout ? I suspect snout could be later/longer and re-machined, if needed. Grooved mains not needed. Cross drilled-maybe. Let's go ! roverman.


rrrover 5L
John Caine
Australia
(28 posts)

Registered:
08/16/2010 08:44AM

Main British Car:


authors avatar
Re: RV8 Custom crank
Posted by: rrrover 5L
Date: February 24, 2012 06:04AM

I'll see if I can take a couple of shots of the Bryant crank in & out of the block. It has turned down counterweights and some big plugs of Mallory Metal to achieve balance. Nice hollow crank pins, too.

Going to be 104 degrees in Melbourne tomorrow. I wont be spending too much time in the shed:-)


minorv8
Jukka Harkola

(268 posts)

Registered:
04/08/2009 06:50AM

Main British Car:
Morris Minor Rover V8

Re: RV8 Custom crank
Posted by: minorv8
Date: February 24, 2012 07:42AM

Would a 2" rod journal size be better for stroker clearance. I have a 91 mm stroke (3,58") and 2" SBC Crower Sportsman rods just clears the 4,6 block. Later Chevy rods with 2,1" will not fit without grinding.

John, I am a bit envious since we have 3 ft of snow and 30 degrees in Helsinki. Enjoy !



rrrover 5L
John Caine
Australia
(28 posts)

Registered:
08/16/2010 08:44AM

Main British Car:


authors avatar
Re: RV8 Custom crank
Posted by: rrrover 5L
Date: February 24, 2012 08:02AM

You're right, Jukka. I shouldn't complain too much based on your weather. I'm looking forward to the F1 GP here in a few weeks & the return of Kimi the flying Finn.

I have a set of 6" Carrillo's with Honda journals. I'm thinking of offset grinding & making the crank 3.7 stroke. With the 3.7 bore, I'd end up around 5.2 litres....


jfjfjf2
Julian Fussell
Somerset
(17 posts)

Registered:
02/18/2012 01:00PM

Main British Car:
TVR Griffith '94 RV8 5ltr

Re: RV8 Custom crank
Posted by: jfjfjf2
Date: February 24, 2012 09:14AM

Art - I'd go with the 2.5" mains but would prefer 2" big ends, that's not an area in which I'd like to add weight, crank pin to take Chevy rod, still plenty of off the shelf rod choice. I need the long nose. Scat frown on cross drilling, I'll let them talk you through their thinking on this, they have an explanation on their website.

Re the 87 mm bore, using thin wall inducted iron liners. I'm told the Dodge Viper uses them.

I'm ready to buy as soon as they're ready to make them.

Julian

P.s. I'm told I'll have drawings tonight, but the TVR specialists I deal with have just ceased trading so everyone has a lot on their plates. They will be useful to get other quotes.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/24/2012 09:21AM by jfjfjf2.


minorv8
Jukka Harkola

(268 posts)

Registered:
04/08/2009 06:50AM

Main British Car:
Morris Minor Rover V8

Re: RV8 Custom crank
Posted by: minorv8
Date: February 24, 2012 09:44AM

Julian, you wouldnīt happen to have a spare TVR 500 crank ?

John, itīs interesting to see how Kimi will succeed !


roverman
Art Gertz
Winchester, CA.
(3188 posts)

Registered:
04/24/2009 11:02AM

Main British Car:
74' Jensen Healy, 79 Huff. GT 1, 74 MGB Lotus 907,2L

Re: RV8 Custom crank
Posted by: roverman
Date: February 24, 2012 11:25AM

3.7" stroke, 6" rod, 8.96" deck(un-cut) leaves 1.11" for ring package. 1.85" rod journal and 7,500 rpm, road racing ? Dry sump ? I forgot, the rover block is "narrower" at the pan rails than 300-350 sbb.Cheers, roverman.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/24/2012 12:01PM by roverman.


jfjfjf2
Julian Fussell
Somerset
(17 posts)

Registered:
02/18/2012 01:00PM

Main British Car:
TVR Griffith '94 RV8 5ltr

Re: RV8 Custom crank
Posted by: jfjfjf2
Date: February 24, 2012 02:21PM

Jukka - I'm going to mothball my existing engine. I'll ask around.

Julian
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