Engine and Transmission Tech

I'm posting this to a new thread because it started in a thread about TA's Rover heads. This was a question from Hoffbug (Tony) on an EFI system. I'm hoping we'll get more response in it's own thread:

Quote:

So.. Not knowing @#$%& about these systems what would I need to make this work?
[sdsefi.com]

I already have the single plane manifold with injector bossses.

You'll need coolant temp, MAP, knock and TP sensors. I can't tell if it uses one or two O2 sensors. Then a VR pick up and crank wheel adapted to the crank. Then you need a fuel rail and injectors. Well and the associated fuel system. Higher pressure pump and regulator. Oh yeah the throttle body.

I thought it was interesting that they showed the coils in the pic since it doesn't come with it. I doesn't show the wiring harness but that's a plus. Ok I just realized that they do mention the coil packs in the first kit for $1900.

I don't know what other guys here would say but for $1450 you could probably get all this stuff needed and a Megasquirt controller already built. The SDS probably has some stock maps already loaded in but those aren't going to matter much because of the custom application. It looks like the SDS has some pretty simple manual controls like the lean rich knob. That's pretty cool.

If I was building an EFI system; I'd use the Ford EDIS stuff for the pick up sensor and spark distribution. They are pretty cheap and easy to use. I bought the entire thing for $99. Here's a pic of the parts:



Then buy a prebuilt Megasquirt, well I'd probably try to build my own but I'm not advocating that, with spark control. I can't remember what it's called… Like Megasquirt II v3 or something like that.

Here's the top-o-the-line MS II 3.57 box prebuilt: [www.diyautotune.com]

That's $405 totally assembled and it's a board you can't even purchase to build yourself. . It doesn't include a serial cable but those are cheap. That's really the same thing as the SDS kit but the interface with the ECU is different. It is WAY simpler with the SDS interface but you've got to spend another $1000 to get it. On the other hand you program the MS with a simple Windows program. It's clunky but works great.

Then get some injectors and fuel rail and the sensors we mentioned. I'm betting you can get a bunch of this stuff used on ebay or something. With the Ford EDIS and preassembled MS II v3.57 we're up to like $520. That leaves almost a grand for the other parts.

All this stuff can get overwhelming pretty quick. It took me a few months to totally comprehend it. When I did I realized it's actually pretty simple from a theory standpoint. I just breaks up the fuel delivery and ignition into individual parts with sensors to keep tabs on what's happening. The benefits are a totally programmable fuel and spark curve for optimal performance and economy. The deficits are pretty obvious: WAY more parts to go bad, complicated and more expensive. From a cost/benefit analysis with a cheaper less complicated carb and distributor you can tune for performance and get it pretty easily but it is always a compromise between performance and everyday economy. It's also sort of a stab at the best case scenario. With this type of system you can tune it for both and be pretty damn accurate to optimize performance and get the most economical consumption.

I ended up with spark control and a carb with a TPS. It's a lot of monkeying around and tuning to make a computer controlled system work. I want to do it but I've got so many other details to work out with the overall project that I needed to simplify one part to get it completed. I figured I'd work into the fuel delivery ECU eventually.

Thanks Nic

So are these systems compatible with E-85?

Totally. It's just a matter of getting the injectors that will juice enough. Maybe get some flex fuel injectors off of something used. The biggest problem with E85 is actually water absorption. I guess that can cause some corrosion as well as the solvent nature of the alcohol. I haven't actually experienced any problems with it yet. I burned E50ish in my Shelby Dakota for a year with not a single side effect. I just took the top end of the engine down to inspect it recently too and it looks cleaner! LOL. I also soaked a spare old Qjet in a bucket of E85 for 8 mo. to see if it did anything. Nothing.

More and more it sounds like a lot of talk to get us to buy more expensive parts. The part I would specifically worry about though is the pump.

I was thinking along the lines of the O2 sensor.. But I guess Oxygen is Oxygen.. You just need to take wahat you are reading into account for e-85's AFR. Right?

That's a good point. Worth researching... It might take a wideband sensor to get what we want.

The problem that I remember that nearly put ARCO stations out of business (and caused them to switch to Atlantic stations) was that some early ceramic floats would disintegrate and jam the fuel filter, stranding people.

I think Saabs and some other makes had ceramic gas tank floats, or perhaps carb floats, and these and other makes that I can't remember had problems.