Steering, Suspension, & Brakes

tips, technology, tools and techniques related to non-driveline mechanical components

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MGBV8
Carl Floyd
Kingsport, TN
(3782 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 11:32PM

Main British Car:
1979 MGB, Buick 215

authors avatar
Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: MGBV8
Date: February 11, 2012 07:13PM

I would really like to convert to 4X100 PCD. The MGB hub is not a very good candidate for redrilling. BMW, Honda, Mazda, Nissan, Saturn, & Toyota all had models with this pattern. Surely, somebody's hub is close enough to be made to fit on a MGB spindle. Problem is, where to find the numbers to do the comparison?


BlownMGB-V8
Jim Blackwood
9406 Gunpowder Rd., Florence, KY 41042
(5821 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 12:59PM

Main British Car:
1971 MGB Blown,Injected,Intercooled Buick 340/AA80E/JagIRS

authors avatar
Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: BlownMGB-V8
Date: February 11, 2012 09:27PM

Darned good question Carl. For most of the hub swaps that are known, (Monte Carlo, etc.) the guys who did it did an actual comparison with junkyard parts. You might want to just take a stroll around your local yard.

Jim


mgb260
Jim Nichols
Sequim,WA
(2004 posts)

Registered:
02/29/2008 08:29PM

Main British Car:
1973 MGB roadster 260 Ford V8

Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: mgb260
Date: February 11, 2012 11:34PM

Carl, Might be tough. 4X100 is a newer lug pattern. All I've seen are sealed bearings with splined FWD three bolt mount hubs. You may have to use a older style 4X4.25 or 4X4.5 and drill the 4X100 inbetween. Maybe change the races and bearings in a older Falcon or Mustang hub. I'll look around and check. Edit: I found it! You want 68-70 Mustang 6 cylinder drum brake 4 lug or 70-72 Maverick or Comet 6 cylinder drum brake 4 lug. Same bearings as MGB. May decrease track width 3/4" on each side if the same as my 5 lug Mustang hubs. Have a machine shop drill 4X100 between the 4X4.5". You would have to go to a slip on 4X100 rotor (Honda). If 22mm thick you can use the small Toyota Calipers. For the rear axle use wire wheel hubs with splined part cut off and drill 4X100 between the stock 4X4.5". Lay the new front hub(Ford) next to the MGB one to figure offset on the rotor needed. You may have to go to the smaller tie rod also. It would be easier to just use the spacer adapter from 4X4.5" to 4X100 pattern.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/12/2012 12:18AM by mgb260.


MGBV8
Carl Floyd
Kingsport, TN
(3782 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 11:32PM

Main British Car:
1979 MGB, Buick 215

authors avatar
Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: MGBV8
Date: February 12, 2012 12:14AM

Okay, some are FWD. BMW, Miata, Opel Kadet & GT, Volvo 440 should be RWD

Can the MGB spindle not be machined so a sealed bearing will work?


mgb260
Jim Nichols
Sequim,WA
(2004 posts)

Registered:
02/29/2008 08:29PM

Main British Car:
1973 MGB roadster 260 Ford V8

Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: mgb260
Date: February 12, 2012 12:23AM

Carl, I don't know about the RWD BMW or Volvo but maybe you can modify the Miata like Art did the RX7 hub. I think he bored and sleeved it to use the tapered races and bearings of a Mustang II. PM Art on the details. You would still have to figure out brakes.Here are pictures of Miata hubs and FWD hubs.
F26156797.jpg
2005-2010 chevy cobalt.jpg



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/12/2012 12:39AM by mgb260.


MGBV8
Carl Floyd
Kingsport, TN
(3782 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 11:32PM

Main British Car:
1979 MGB, Buick 215

authors avatar
Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: MGBV8
Date: February 12, 2012 09:55AM

Jim, I am familiar with the bolt on hubs. In fact, I have one that I need to replace on my Silverado 4X4 SOON. :)

That Miata hub looks like it should just slide right on. Use a slip on rotor. I know, toooo easy.

I was hoping to find a lot of specs sheets with measurements like this one for comparisons:

[recstuff.com]


tr8todd
Todd Kishbach

(359 posts)

Registered:
12/04/2009 07:42AM

Main British Car:


Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: tr8todd
Date: February 12, 2012 12:00PM

First place to start looking is bearing sizes on the old and the replacement candidate. If both the inner and outer bearings are the same size or can be drilled out to match, you will be in the ballpark. Go to a website like NAPA, punch in the car you want to look at, and see what bearings are used. I looked into switching hubs for the TR8. I have sets of both BMW 2002 and BMW 320i on the shelf and compared them to TR8. I decided it was just easier to keep the stock hubs and offset drill the holes for the wheel studs. The now larger holes use a larger knurled head stud. Stock TR8 is 4X95.25 and uses roughly a .47" hole. The new holes are .6375 or something like that, and drilled on a 4X100. The new larger hole completely encompasses the old hole with a different center. The hardened studs are from a Dodge truck and use .5" lugnuts instead of 12mm. Now my TR8 and my 2002 can run the same race wheels, and so far it's worked out well. Only issue is the limited amount of low offsets wheels available in 4X100, since 4X100 is mostly a FWD fitment. If you want measurements for the BMW hubs let me know. 4X108 works better for RWD offsets, but that was too big for me to go with the stock hubs. Hubs with that bolt pattern might be a better option for the B.



BlownMGB-V8
Jim Blackwood
9406 Gunpowder Rd., Florence, KY 41042
(5821 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 12:59PM

Main British Car:
1971 MGB Blown,Injected,Intercooled Buick 340/AA80E/JagIRS

authors avatar
Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: BlownMGB-V8
Date: February 12, 2012 12:31PM

So how close is the TR7 hub to MGB? Same bearings maybe? similar offset?

Jim


mgb260
Jim Nichols
Sequim,WA
(2004 posts)

Registered:
02/29/2008 08:29PM

Main British Car:
1973 MGB roadster 260 Ford V8

Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: mgb260
Date: February 12, 2012 12:55PM

I used Rockauto wheel bearing specs to compare MGB bearings to the Mustang hubs. TR7 look smaller than Midgets.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/12/2012 01:04PM by mgb260.


mgb260
Jim Nichols
Sequim,WA
(2004 posts)

Registered:
02/29/2008 08:29PM

Main British Car:
1973 MGB roadster 260 Ford V8

Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: mgb260
Date: February 12, 2012 01:20PM

Here is a good picture of Miata spindle with RX7 hub adapter and hub. Notice the straight spindle.
3721152798_3b339f43d3.jpg


mgb260
Jim Nichols
Sequim,WA
(2004 posts)

Registered:
02/29/2008 08:29PM

Main British Car:
1973 MGB roadster 260 Ford V8

Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: mgb260
Date: February 12, 2012 02:13PM

MGB inside bearing ID is 1.25". Can't seem to find ID of Miata front bearing. It seems you replace the hub as a unit. If you get Miata hubs and the diameter is larger you could sleeve the MGB spindle as above picture. If Miata hub is smaller you would have to turn MGB Spindle down. In both cases use inner spacer where the MGB spindle tapers smaller.


BlownMGB-V8
Jim Blackwood
9406 Gunpowder Rd., Florence, KY 41042
(5821 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 12:59PM

Main British Car:
1971 MGB Blown,Injected,Intercooled Buick 340/AA80E/JagIRS

authors avatar
Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: BlownMGB-V8
Date: February 12, 2012 02:31PM

The Mustang the Monte-Carlo (Mid size GM) used the exact same bearings as the MGB, the only difference was in the spacing, where the MGB had the bearings closer together. So it is likely that almost all small to mid size domestic cars of that era used the same bearings too. Not sure if that helps though since a 4 x 100 pattern might be hard to find, but you might find one you could redrill. By the time you do that and re-bore the bearing seat for the right width though it isn't exactly a simple solution.

Using a hub with a cartridge bearing might work OK. Chances are good the bore will be metric though so matching the MG inner spindle diameter may be hard unless you have adapter sleeves made for it. That might give you more leeway on the offset though. Cartridge bearing life used to be much shorter than conventional spindle bearings, though I suspect they've gotten better.

Carl, if you aren't in a super hurry, we might collaborate on a couple sets of billet aluminum hubs.

Jim


mgb260
Jim Nichols
Sequim,WA
(2004 posts)

Registered:
02/29/2008 08:29PM

Main British Car:
1973 MGB roadster 260 Ford V8

Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: mgb260
Date: February 12, 2012 02:56PM

Jim, You might find a ready market in dual bolt pattern hubs. Say 4 3/4" and 4 1/2" 5 lug and 4 1/2" and 4X100 4 lug to fit MGB spindle. I mentioned the 4 lug Mustang,Maverick and Comet hub above. If it has the same offset as the V8 hubs I have track width will be narrower. I use the stock MGB rear seal flared out slightly. I use Intrepid 12mm studs in front and 98-2002 Camaro Firebird Corvette 12mm studs in rear. Front studs use stock Mustang hole size,rear use 15/32" hole. Pull in with nut and washers. Would be beneficial to use narrower wire wheel rear axle for more room for wider rims. Of course you would eliminate the bump stop hump. Stock MGB rear hub is too thin to use 4X100 pattern between stock holes. Wire wheel hub is thicker and would work if you remove the splined part.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/12/2012 03:11PM by mgb260.


mgb260
Jim Nichols
Sequim,WA
(2004 posts)

Registered:
02/29/2008 08:29PM

Main British Car:
1973 MGB roadster 260 Ford V8

Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: mgb260
Date: February 12, 2012 05:27PM

Carl, Early 80's Honda Accord and Civic rear hubs use same outer bearing as MGB(BR2) and a size smaller inner bearng(BR8)1.98" OD race.MGB has (BR6) 2.328" OD race inner. Maybe enough material to bore out to MGB(BR6) race size. Rear hubs on FWD cars are free spinning,not splined like front. Lightweight hubs that have large holes between lugs.
130_0812_25_z+suspension_tech+first_unstake_the_hub_nut.jpg



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 02/12/2012 09:28PM by mgb260.


roverman
Art Gertz
Winchester, CA.
(3005 posts)

Registered:
04/24/2009 11:02AM

Main British Car:
74' Jensen Healy, 79 Huff. GT 1, 74 MGB Lotus 907,2L

Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: roverman
Date: February 13, 2012 12:08PM

"Jim's" and clan, perhaps the Monte Carlo spindle you refer to is GM "A" and "F" body,1964-1974, cars like Skylark, Cutlass etc. Popular in aftermarket, forged, good value with 8.825" overall height, BJ taper, top/bott measure .63"/big ends. Steering arms bolt on with 4.125" bc's.,(front/rear steer). Good Luck, roverman.



MGBV8
Carl Floyd
Kingsport, TN
(3782 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 11:32PM

Main British Car:
1979 MGB, Buick 215

authors avatar
Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: MGBV8
Date: February 13, 2012 08:38PM

Quote:
Early 80's Honda Accord and Civic rear hubs use same outer bearing as MGB(BR2) and a size smaller inner bearng(BR8)1.98" OD race.MGB has (BR6) 2.328" OD race inner.

Thanks for the numbers, Jim. That gives me something to go on.


MGBV8
Carl Floyd
Kingsport, TN
(3782 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 11:32PM

Main British Car:
1979 MGB, Buick 215

authors avatar
Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: MGBV8
Date: February 13, 2012 08:47PM

Quote:
Carl, if you aren't in a super hurry, we might collaborate on a couple sets of billet aluminum hubs.

No hurry. Too much to do before the V8 Meet, anyway.


BlownMGB-V8
Jim Blackwood
9406 Gunpowder Rd., Florence, KY 41042
(5821 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 12:59PM

Main British Car:
1971 MGB Blown,Injected,Intercooled Buick 340/AA80E/JagIRS

authors avatar
Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: BlownMGB-V8
Date: February 13, 2012 09:34PM

We'll talk about it.

Jim


MGBV8
Carl Floyd
Kingsport, TN
(3782 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 11:32PM

Main British Car:
1979 MGB, Buick 215

authors avatar
Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: MGBV8
Date: February 14, 2012 04:01PM

Hmmm.
Quote:
On MGB spindles I'm using 64-66 Mustang hubs

What does the backside of those hubs look like? Possible to redrill to 4x100 if any can be found?


mgb260
Jim Nichols
Sequim,WA
(2004 posts)

Registered:
02/29/2008 08:29PM

Main British Car:
1973 MGB roadster 260 Ford V8

Re: Where to go for hub specs?
Posted by: mgb260
Date: February 14, 2012 10:59PM

Carl, Yes. I'm using 64-66 Mustang V8 5 lug hubs,you would use 68-70 6 cylinder 4 lug hubs (also 70-72 Maverick or Comet). You can buy them new from Mustang repro catalogs. Last year they were $70 each. I got mine from a local wrecking yard for $25 each(car-part.com).You could just drill 4X100 pattern between the 4X4.5 Mustang pattern. Look above in this thread for more info on wheel studs,track width etc.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/14/2012 11:04PM by mgb260.
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