Steering, Suspension, & Brakes

tips, technology, tools and techniques related to non-driveline mechanical components

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ex-tyke
Graham Creswick
Chatham, Ontario, Canada
(1163 posts)

Registered:
10/25/2007 11:17AM

Main British Car:
1976 MGB Ford 302

authors avatar
Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: ex-tyke
Date: October 11, 2022 05:58PM

Quote:
These hubs are custom aluminum from Bill Guzman: [www.classicconversionseng.com]

True I have a set.. although Id be hard pressed to say the lower unsprung weight contributed to an improved ride

Surprised that no one has mentioned that Bill has developed a front suspension as another option to Hoyle/Frontline - maybe worth looking at!

[www.classicconversionseng.com]


Airwreckc
Eric Cumming
RTP, North Carolina
(190 posts)

Registered:
05/28/2020 10:10AM

Main British Car:
1972 MGB-GT (working on a Sebring project) Buick 300-4 V8

Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: Airwreckc
Date: October 12, 2022 09:11AM

I considered Bill's suspension, but it's over twice the price of the Hoyle unit. Not sure if it has any advantages.


mgb260
Jim Nichols
Sequim,WA
(2383 posts)

Registered:
02/29/2008 08:29PM

Main British Car:
1973 MGB roadster 260 Ford V8

Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: mgb260
Date: October 12, 2022 10:57AM

Graham has the Moss coilover with drop spindles. How much are they in the UK?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/12/2022 01:30PM by mgb260.


Airwreckc
Eric Cumming
RTP, North Carolina
(190 posts)

Registered:
05/28/2020 10:10AM

Main British Car:
1972 MGB-GT (working on a Sebring project) Buick 300-4 V8

Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: Airwreckc
Date: October 12, 2022 01:54PM

The Moss system appears to be about the same price as the Hoyle (at least with the current exchange rate), but it's on back order: [mossmotors.com]


MGBV8
Carl Floyd
Kingsport, TN
(4408 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 11:32PM

Main British Car:
1979 MGB Buick 215

authors avatar
Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: MGBV8
Date: October 12, 2022 02:37PM

"I considered Bill's suspension, but it's over twice the price of the Hoyle unit. Not sure if it has any advantages."

Bill's has ball joints & a better shock angle for starters.


Airwreckc
Eric Cumming
RTP, North Carolina
(190 posts)

Registered:
05/28/2020 10:10AM

Main British Car:
1972 MGB-GT (working on a Sebring project) Buick 300-4 V8

Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: Airwreckc
Date: October 12, 2022 03:33PM

Carl, thanks. I realized the ball joints were there after I posted. Didn't realize the shock angle was different.


MGBV8
Carl Floyd
Kingsport, TN
(4408 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 11:32PM

Main British Car:
1979 MGB Buick 215

authors avatar
Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: MGBV8
Date: October 12, 2022 03:49PM

I plan to keep tweaking what I have.



Airwreckc
Eric Cumming
RTP, North Carolina
(190 posts)

Registered:
05/28/2020 10:10AM

Main British Car:
1972 MGB-GT (working on a Sebring project) Buick 300-4 V8

Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: Airwreckc
Date: October 13, 2022 09:30AM

I just found this comparison of the Frontline and Hoyle suspensions. I think I'm going to order the Hoyle, and will try to upgrade it to ball joints with the information posted here.

[www.mg-cars.net]


MGBV8
Carl Floyd
Kingsport, TN
(4408 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 11:32PM

Main British Car:
1979 MGB Buick 215

authors avatar
Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: MGBV8
Date: October 13, 2022 09:56AM

That link does not provide any ball joint conversion info.


BlownMGB-V8
Jim Blackwood
9406 Gunpowder Rd., Florence, KY 41042
(6404 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 12:59PM

Main British Car:
1971 MGB Blown,Injected,Intercooled Buick 340/AA80E/JagIRS

authors avatar
Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: BlownMGB-V8
Date: October 13, 2022 11:08AM

Might be able to upgrade the kingpins with TSL type tapered bearings which include an integral seal.

Jim


Airwreckc
Eric Cumming
RTP, North Carolina
(190 posts)

Registered:
05/28/2020 10:10AM

Main British Car:
1972 MGB-GT (working on a Sebring project) Buick 300-4 V8

Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: Airwreckc
Date: October 13, 2022 12:53PM

This is the link I was referring to regarding the potential king pin to ball joint conversion: [www.mgexp.com]

The link I previously posted was just comparing the Hoyle to the Frontline kits.


Airwreckc
Eric Cumming
RTP, North Carolina
(190 posts)

Registered:
05/28/2020 10:10AM

Main British Car:
1972 MGB-GT (working on a Sebring project) Buick 300-4 V8

Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: Airwreckc
Date: October 13, 2022 12:59PM

Jim,

Regarding the TSL bearing conversion, did you ever look into this? Looks like it could be easier than the ball joint conversation, but I'm not sure where to look for the bearings that could fit (or anything else, for that matter).


MGBV8
Carl Floyd
Kingsport, TN
(4408 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 11:32PM

Main British Car:
1979 MGB Buick 215

authors avatar
Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: MGBV8
Date: October 13, 2022 04:35PM

Yes, several of us have been following that thread with interest.


BlownMGB-V8
Jim Blackwood
9406 Gunpowder Rd., Florence, KY 41042
(6404 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 12:59PM

Main British Car:
1971 MGB Blown,Injected,Intercooled Buick 340/AA80E/JagIRS

authors avatar
Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: BlownMGB-V8
Date: October 14, 2022 11:41AM

This could help:

[www.lily-bearing.com]

Jim


Airwreckc
Eric Cumming
RTP, North Carolina
(190 posts)

Registered:
05/28/2020 10:10AM

Main British Car:
1972 MGB-GT (working on a Sebring project) Buick 300-4 V8

Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: Airwreckc
Date: October 14, 2022 01:31PM

Jim,

That looks like a great resource. Thanks much.



mstemp
Mike Stemp
Calgary, Canada
(222 posts)

Registered:
11/25/2009 07:18AM

Main British Car:
1980 MGB Rover 4.6L

Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: mstemp
Date: October 15, 2022 04:28PM

Bills kit also includes $1300 worth of brakes, hubs etc. so cant really be compared to the Hoyle or Frontline kits. MGOC unit at least has the ball joints for 1200 GBP.


BlownMGB-V8
Jim Blackwood
9406 Gunpowder Rd., Florence, KY 41042
(6404 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 12:59PM

Main British Car:
1971 MGB Blown,Injected,Intercooled Buick 340/AA80E/JagIRS

authors avatar
Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: BlownMGB-V8
Date: October 15, 2022 05:15PM

So the closest bore sizes in the TSL bearings are .750 and .875" with the corresponding kingpin sizes being .780 and .900" sp .030 and .025" undersized respectively. That means that the kingpins would have to be turned to size but also that used pins can be used. So bad and good news both.

Might be possible to go with spacers instead, .875 for .780 (.095 or a .0475" wall) and 1" for .9 (.050" wall). That is probably feasible as well and a slightly less difficult of a machining task but would mean the need for new kingpins which aren't exactly cheap. Should be possible to work with both the OD and height.

Should also be possible to use them for the cross shaft attachment to the control arms. That would require boring the ends of the kingpin for them but I am pretty sure there is enough meat to do that.

Pretty much a permanent fix for the kingpin bushing issue.

Jim


Airwreckc
Eric Cumming
RTP, North Carolina
(190 posts)

Registered:
05/28/2020 10:10AM

Main British Car:
1972 MGB-GT (working on a Sebring project) Buick 300-4 V8

Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: Airwreckc
Date: October 17, 2022 09:18AM

Great information Jim. I assume the use of spacers is also preferable as it allows a replaceable wear surface, so instead of replacing kingpins down the road, use can just replace the cheap spacers?


BlownMGB-V8
Jim Blackwood
9406 Gunpowder Rd., Florence, KY 41042
(6404 posts)

Registered:
10/23/2007 12:59PM

Main British Car:
1971 MGB Blown,Injected,Intercooled Buick 340/AA80E/JagIRS

authors avatar
Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: BlownMGB-V8
Date: October 17, 2022 10:33AM

Eric, maybe spacers between the inner races on the horizontal joints at top and bottom where the A-arms attach but I don't think they would be needed on the kingpin itself, just preload to spec. Guess you could add a spacer sleeve if you wanted to. Any wear should be in the bearings and that should never be an issue. Whether you used the rubber bushings at the top or not would be your choice.

Jim


Airwreckc
Eric Cumming
RTP, North Carolina
(190 posts)

Registered:
05/28/2020 10:10AM

Main British Car:
1972 MGB-GT (working on a Sebring project) Buick 300-4 V8

Re: Front Suspension Upgrade
Posted by: Airwreckc
Date: October 17, 2022 11:03AM

Jim, thanks. I think this is the route I am going to try. I ended up getting the Hoyle suspension, so it should make for an interesting combination.
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